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25 YEARS OF LOCAL GOVERNMENT - Shared screen with speaker view
Muthotho SIGIDI
01:22:29
The input re-participation of specific stakeholders in the IDP is very important and should be looked at as one of what should be recommended as part of enhancing the DDM. I once looked at the framework that eThekwini was using engaging stakeholders in the design of the IDP. I found that very useful in that engagement was separated. You engage Professionals separately. Traditional leaders, business people etc and at the last IDP rep forum all inputs have been consolidated and now shared with the broader forum.
Mthobeli Kolisa
01:23:39
I agree with Muthotho.
Mthobeli Kolisa
01:26:55
I also think that the part about PPP is a very important. As we get into the next term of LG, we need to be more purposeful in facilitating private sector participation in LG investment.
Pascal Moloi
01:32:15
I suggest we look at the KZN model (Sukuma something)as a model. It seems to be very effective and can be replicated. Its genesis might have been based on specific material conditions like dealing with violence, taxi wars, political conflicts. It the response to these conditions that have resulted in the current approach.
Pascal Moloi
01:36:42
I hope there are partici
Pascal Moloi
01:37:44
I hope there are participants from orgs like the isandla institute and Planact available to contribute to this discussion
Seun Mogotji
01:40:16
In an unfortunate turn of events, service delivery protest at Masakaneng in Limpopo resulted in loss of two lives. On Monday as the police chased protesters, a woman felt and succumbed to death. Another person was shot later dead after altercation with taxi driver, incident directly linked to that protest at Masakaneng the Limpopo government in particular MEC Gogtha is running all over like a headless chicken trying to look like he cares.That poor woman's and poor man death could've been avoided had the MEC made time to go and address that community or if he was as busy as he claimed he could have delegated some officials to attend to the matter but true to their nature an innocent lifes had to be lost before they can mobilise,how sad.What is now worse is that instead of going to Masakaneng they have asked the community to organise transport and go to Polokwane to meet with the MEC.Here we are talking about mostly unemployed poor people who barely survive on handouts and social grants and the MEC expect
Nkosinathi Mthethwa
01:46:42
In the early 2000s, government introduced the CDWs as agents of change to facilitate service delivery across the 3 spheres of govt at ward level. Unfortunately this initiative failed dismally. Pascal the KZN Model is called Operation Sukuma Sakhe (OSS) - ward based war rooms.
Lekula Sydwell Mofokeng
03:27:56
i agree with Pascal
Michelle R Maziwisa
03:57:30
To Sly Mamabolo- Thank you for your presentation. I am especially interested in women's representation in multilevel government systems. My question is in your view should the IEC have any role in requiring party lists to be gender representative, and could it in future reject PR lists that do not have 50 percent women for local government elections?
Michelle R Maziwisa
03:58:03
Sy Mamabolo*
Sy Mamabolo
03:59:22
Very good suggestion, it will however require legislative amendment
Michelle R Maziwisa
04:00:12
That's fair. Thank you for your response.
Muthotho SIGIDI
04:04:09
I missed the initial part of the presentation, but this matter Michelle is raising is fundamental into how the electoral system bring in gender representativity. It might be compromised by the constituency based system unless the parties will be able to say this is how they will deploy women candidates like what we do with ward committee representations
Muhammed Lokhat
04:09:54
My question with regards to the move to constituency based systems/ independent candidates is that a single, certain political party will have overwhelming power to demarcate the new regions/voting districts in any new system. How would the IEC play a role, if any, in preventing gerrymandering or any other abuses in the move to the new electoral system?
Mcebisi Ndletjana
04:12:06
Can the IEC receive private donations, by the way, in lieu of the financial squeeze.
Muhammed Lokhat
04:12:48
(2) my understanding of the New Nations judgment is that independent candidates will only be able to run for provincial/national legislature. Will the president/premiers still be voted in by those legislatures? or are there murmurings that this process will be changed as well?
Ivor Chipkin
04:17:03
Any answer to Mcebisi’s question?Can the IEC receive private donations, by the way, in lieu of the financial squeeze.
Sy Mamabolo
04:17:26
New Nation Movement judgement does not address the issue of the election of the President and Premiers. The issue is the election of members of Parliament and members of legislatures
Muhammed Lokhat
04:20:13
I understand that @Sy. My questions is with regard to whether there are plans to go further with the change to constituency systems, are there plans/ideas/whispers for this to be changed as well?
Michael Sachs
06:48:54
The second reason education/capacity building etc is unlikely to “solve” these problems is that the political apparatus (which occupies and dominates the idea of “community”) systematically ejects the people that you successfully improve.
Ivor Chipkin
06:58:42
Historically, autonomous administrations are what provide the continuity in government. So while politics is by definition turbulent and chaotic, a solid admin is what gives institutions stability. It requires admitting a distinction between political office and administrative office. In SA in general we fail to respect this boundary. In local government we do not even make it.
Michael Sachs
07:01:42
! The claim that Italy “works” is disputed
Ivor Chipkin
07:02:10
Italy works damn well!
Ivor Chipkin
07:03:28
In those areas where civil society is not dominated or constrained by the (Catholic) church - see Putnam.
Ivor Chipkin
07:05:46
Bureaucratic autonomy… I am a very happy man :)
Nishendra Moodley
07:06:42
We need to develop strong and resilient administrations (insulated from political shocks).
Tebogo Matlou
07:11:22
without a clear leadership understanding of the roles by both cllrs, officials, community & willingness to cooperate, these representations of governance are ephemeral. Power is too much on one side.
Michael Sachs
07:19:41
agreed
Roland Hunter
07:45:39
Do the induction programmes for new councillors adequately address these issues?
Ivor Chipkin
07:54:11
SCM is the weakest link in the technical capacity of municipalities - I agree.
Ivor Chipkin
07:57:24
Geo’s contribution is a break-through. Takes up themes of the ‘contract state’.
Nkosinathi Mthethwa
07:58:39
The tender system in its totality must be reviewed
Trevor Fowler
07:59:09
I do not feel that induction programme is inadequate and requires continuous development. Besides the complexity of local government, the policies and implementation approaches should change as the developmental agenda is successfully implemented.
Kam Chetty
08:02:45
We cannot afford to be simplistic about SCM. The complexity in SCM is affected by powerful local interests, party political factors (power ambitions, PP funding, etc) and criminal syndicates. This requires a more detailed examination and analysis.
Nishendra Moodley
08:07:01
Fully agree that a focus on compliance and price as the determinant of procurement rather than outcomes is anti-developmental. Transparency and multi-stakeholder oversight is also an important method of ensuring integrity without over-regulation.
Mthobeli Kolisa
08:07:12
Part of the problem with SCM in municipalities is that the structuring of SCM is centralised by law. It becomes both a bottleneck and a centralised point of maladministration especially in bigger municipalities. A Metro with a total procurement expenditure of more than R5bn per annum, has to procure through one administrative support capacity under one CFO. This is in contract to provincial and national spheres of government where departments are responsible for their procurement processes. There is a need for a differentiation in respect of this.
Muhammed Lokhat
08:11:36
@Sibongile, tying into the earlier discussions today. How do we ensure this continuation of service delivery even through this constant"change of guard" especially going into the era of tenuous coalition politics
Nkosinathi Mthethwa
08:25:05
In most municipalities the genesis of conflict between management and politicians is SCM related processes.
Ivor Chipkin
08:26:04
@sibongile We do it by building autonomous administrations.
Kam Chetty
08:26:50
The usefulness of IDPs in its current form creates more problems than solutions. Its structure and process is regulated - and the current experiences utilize tired practices that is mechanistic. We need a new framework that places the appropriate priority (should not be a party/power political exercise) on investment decisions. We need to recognize the culture that is now deeply embedded, and we need a stepped change from these negative practices.
Tebogo Matlou
08:29:09
The making of large profits by private companies while LG cary financial & other risks due to excalations of prices. there must be sound reasons for adopting the partnership model to buy resources & evident benefits to be gained through that model
Lekula Sydwell Mofokeng
08:57:42
The discussion is more about what Xolile presented earlier. The burden of compliance versus service delivery and the Appetite for compliance.The decline in performance is not about performance and capacity but it is a result of patronage tasking precedence